immigration policy
What are borders actually for?: Communitarians
What a place owes My grandmother came to this country in 1951. Took the bus to a garment factory every morning for twenty-three years. Learned English watching soap operas. She would have had very little patience for anyone who told her borders were illegitimate.... What are borders actually for?: Functional borders
The Schengen proof March 26, 1995. Seven European countries did something no theorist in 1945 would have predicted: they eliminated their borders. Not symbolically. The checkpoints were dismantled. A Belgian driver crossed into France without stopping.... What are borders actually for?: Open borders
The trillion-dollar sidewalk In 2013, economist Michael Clemens published a calculation so large it sounded like satire. If borders were open — if people could move to where their labor was most productive — global GDP would increase by 50 to 150 percent.... What are borders actually for?: Sovereignty-first
The body count Four hundred thirty-seven. Migrant bodies recovered by the Border Patrol’s Missing Migrant Program in fiscal year 2022 — the highest on record. The open borders camp uses that number against us. They should not.... What are borders actually for?: The Story
The invisible line Describe a border crossing to someone who has never seen one. A line, usually invisible, sometimes marked by a river or a fence or a man in a booth. On one side, a set of laws. On the other, a different set.... May I see Your ID Please. AT the top,l et me say I pride myself as being what I call a common sense Centrist, I think good governance is good governance simple as that. I think Its Good for Gvt to defend our country, pave our roads, help people recover from disaster, provide Limited help to people who need ot be lifted out of poverty. You get the picture. NOT good for GVT; tell me what books I can read, installing religious beliefs in schools, basically stay out of my Beliefs.
Hopefully that qualifies me as a reasonable common sense human.
Having said that, Lets try this.
Some form of Identification requirement for Voting is not such a horribe Idea.
Some support for my Argument.
If I want to FLY, I must provide a Gvt issued ID
If I want to Operate a Motor Vehicle- I MUST have the GVT Issued License.
If I want to go to the library I need a "card" to do So.
If I buy Tickets for a Show and go to Willcall to get the tix. I need to Provide ID.
The Left says that VOTER ID would discourage Some from Voting. The Rght says that attitude Proves that the Democrat leaders encourage Voter Fraud AND those fraudulent voters ALWAYS vote Democratic. There is NO evidence tthat actually Happens in any organized way. And, Who are these people that want to Vote Illegally, How many of them are out there. Enough to change the outcome of elections? Im a cynic on that Idea.
Im Saying it's time to Put this debate to bed. Provide a State Issued Voter ID.
In NJ The Motor Vehicle Comission Issues the "REAL ID". It has deep proof of who I am. If the GVT trusts that and will let me get on a Plane, It seems to me that should Qualify as a way to verify I have a verified way to Vote.
Without having a proper ID, how would anyone know if a non citizen is voting? The question suggesting if it really makes a difference is laughable. What party caters to the non citizens? What party let them in unvetted and en masse?... Has the Left changed that much? During the Obama administration ICE used the exact tactics they are using today. There were no riots or protests. What changed?
They might have had similar goals (only if one approaches the subject as deporting those here illegally), but certainly not even in the same universe when it comes to tactics, actions, training, policies, accountability, and most importantly, motives.... INTRODUCTION Neither King Nor Mob I first encountered American politics as an argument, not a spectacle. At fifteen, I read The Federalist Papers and the Anti-Federalist responses.... What's in a question...". Here's a scenario...
I say something. It could be anything but for the sake of argument, "I hope Trump runs for a third term."
People in hearing range are heard to ask (examples):
- What do you mean by that?
- Umm, have you read the Constitution?
- Why?
- How do you think that benefits the country?
My interest... Which, if any, of those questions might be considered an invitation to dialogue? Which might elicit a defensive or angry response? If we accept a premise that Our country is being damaged by polarization and hostility, how do we engage with one another to explore the why's behind opinions held? What is your base response when someone asks you a question?
I have observed what I think is shift in definition (or perception) regarding the purpose of a question. To some extent, I think the use and nature of questions has been placed in a negative light. And, that is hazardous to Our ability to gather and analyze information as well as Our opportunities communicate about important societal issues.
At a base level, how much does tone of voice matter? Does who asked -how they look- matter? Does the choice of words affect your response? The time or place? How much of your response is determined primarily by how you interpret the question versus how the questioner might have intended it?
Additional circumstances where I wonder about questions and what they mean or do...
- How often does a politician who represents you ask your opinion before voting on a matter?
- Are public polls and surveys able to collect opinion fairly? (I.E., Shouldn't there generally be a "None of the above" option for almost everything you've ever been asked? Or, data about who is taking the poll and for what purpose? I am tired of being forced to answer in a way that defines my 'social box' incorrectly.)
- Particularly with regard to evaluation of programs, we are asked to place ourselves in various classifications. Income, race, faith, address, age - you know what I mean. These "metrics" are quantitative and objective but... Who decides on the ranges?; Who decides on definitions? When we are measuring whether the quality of someones life has improved, do we need more 'humetrics'?
Have I perhaps managed to kindle curiosity in a dark corner ? :-) It seems to me that this is worth thinking and talking about. It may be part of healing and finding our individual agency to affect the world. It might also be a part of solving problems in a way that promotes positive-sum outcomes.Sadly, if there were no paid agitators assaulting ICE agents, there would be no need to bring in border patrol agents in the first place. The sad reality is the the state and local officials are not cooperating with ICE, which makes the job more difficult, and the things are... It's no big deal if illegals get deported. Ok, say I fly to Norway and blow past my visa deadline. I figure out a way to make that sweet Norway income and tap into some of those sweet social services. Maybe I even start a family there. Then say I get busted and deported. Am I being oppressed? Is Norway mistreating me? No, not in the slightest. I broke laws, got away with it and lived the good life for a while, then got busted and sent back to my real life.
Liberals have rules. They loose their shit if I call a them a him. But people can live here illegally and that should be protected? wtf?
On the specific issue I have almost no expertise, so I'm just spitballing with no research here: I think borders, as made up (and historically fraught) as they are, are still a necessity for our global era and therefore should mean something and be protected, but I think we... Discussion of border/immigration answers. I have the sense that Vance/Trump probably want to be fairly inhumane in deporting extremely large numbers of people. Various quotes I’ve seen from them have suggested this (though I’d like to fact check myself at some point).
But Vance does a very effective job of sounding more reasonable during the debate on this. Starts with things most people would agree with: secure the border; focus on deporting
criminals,
etc. E.g. on deportingcriminals
: that’s a place where perhaps I’d be supportive in extreme cases but where I’d want to be much more humane in minor cases which might be the vast majority of relevant ones. E.g. does getting a speeding ticket make you acriminal
?Noting I have lots of uncertainty and lack of knowledge here. But have the sense that reasonable rhetoric could hide extreme action that I wouldn’t support…
Yeah, this is a great articulation of the phenomenon I was trying to gesture at. And it also helps reveal to me an assumption I’m making: I’m assuming that Trump’s incendiary statements represent how he actually feels and what he’ll try to actually make policy based on (and that... fact checking: fentanyl situation. how are folks receiving Vance’s claim that Kamala Harris’ border policy allowed more fentanyl into the country?
i don’t know much about this topic
OK, I dug further. This is the transcript from the briefing where Harris was given her role: https://www.whitehouse.gov/briefing-room/speeches-remarks/2021/03/24/remarks-by-president-biden-and-vice-president-harris-in-a-meeting-on-immigration/ These seem to be the important... fact checking: fentanyl situation. how are folks receiving Vance’s claim that Kamala Harris’ border policy allowed more fentanyl into the country?
i don’t know much about this topic
I think I might trust Perplexity over your memory ;) Also, I read through our previous exchange, and what I’m seeing is that you said she was appointed Immigration Czar, and I said I didn’t care about the label – is there somewhere you’re seeing where I said she was appointed... fact checking: fentanyl situation. how are folks receiving Vance’s claim that Kamala Harris’ border policy allowed more fentanyl into the country?
i don’t know much about this topic
Mostly from memory. I remember her being declared the Immigration Czar, and then later I remember people criticizing the failures of the policies the last few years (with immigration increasing dramatically compared to Trump or Obama years), and then I remember this whole meme of... fact checking: fentanyl situation. how are folks receiving Vance’s claim that Kamala Harris’ border policy allowed more fentanyl into the country?
i don’t know much about this topic
The discussion starts with thehunmonkgroup correcting the assertion that the border policy is Kamala Harris’ responsibility, highlighting that it is Biden’s policy....